Guest Chapter 23
Name: Tyrone Glover
Current Position: Founding Attorney, Tyrone Glover, Esq.
Former Post-Law School Positions: Attorney, Killmer Lane and Newman, LLP; Partner, Haddon Morgan & Foreman, P.C.; Partner Stimson Glover Stancil Leedy, LLC; Senior Deputy Public Defender, Denver Office of the State Public Defender; Attorney, Shepherd Ross, P.C.
Legal Practice Area: Civil Rights, Criminal Defense, Personal Injury
Law School and Year: University of Colorado, 2009
Time between undergrad and law school: 5 years (professional MMA fighter)
One or two books I recommend:
Autobiography of Malcolm X by Alex Haley: A real-life story of redemption, inspiration, enlightenment, and embracing the personal authenticity of where you stand in the world at any given moment. This book reminds me that there is value in the path, and even as you grow and learn, you can do phenomenal things along the way. It also empowers me to self-reflect and not be afraid to break molds to progress in my own personal evolution.
Devil in the Grove: Thurgood Marshall, the Groveland Boys, and the Dawn of a New America by Gilbert King: When we think about our legal heroes, we mostly remember them in their most prominent career capstone roles. This book follows Thurgood Marshall when he was a scrappy civil rights lawyer as he defended four wrongfully accused Black boys in the Jim Crow south. His tenacity to prevail even in the face of credible death threats is inspiring to any lawyer endeavoring to take on unjust systems.
Short background on why I went to law school
As a Black man, I was made personally aware of inequality and prejudice at a very early age. My parents and grandparents tirelessly fought to break barriers and improve conditions for our family and in our society. It has always been very important to me to find some way to address these same issues.
After college, when I was competing as a professional fighter, I saw up close the way systematic power dynamics could be used to exploit people. Many of my fight-teammates came from marginalized communities and were prime targets for being taken advantage of by more sophisticated promoters, agents, and even coaches. I recognized, on both a macro and micro level, the good that I could do by going to law school and using my degree, and the knowledge that came with it, to empower people against those who sought to subjugate them. So, I retired undefeated in my prime to go to law school.What frustrated me most about coming out of law school and/or what frustrates me with regards to people I work with or hire who are newly out of law school
Law school felt very much like a bubble to me. I did not realize while in law school how the work we do as lawyers affects our communities and the people in them. The #1 core concept of this book is empathy. It requires you to understand where your clients are coming from. I think this feat is difficult for some when they first graduate from law school, unless during law school you explore the intersectionality of what we do in our profession and the role it plays in society. I find that newly out of law school lawyers don't understand the great influence our actions have on the day-to-day realities of our neighbors. Some lawyers never reckon with this and retreat to their own organization or practice ecospheres, as we have been conditioned to do by the law school experience, which is often removed from reality.
How have you used (or not) the core concepts of lawyering as this book proposes: Empathy, Listening First, Asking Questions, and Giving Advice?
Lawyering must be client centered. Which is why these core concepts are essentially the foundations of my law practice. As a litigator, and former professional fighter, my natural inclination is to jump-in and tussle. But what I have learned over the years is that I can best serve people by identifying and embodying in my practice just exactly what I am fighting for.
I have a duty to seek justice for people. The concept of justice is personal and can be different for each individual. Trying to step into a person's shoes, to really hear them, and to identify what justice looks like for their unique situation helps me meet their needs.Biggest mistake(s) you made while in law school
My biggest mistake was getting wrapped up in competing for what everyone else wanted in law school, as opposed to following my own gut and passions. Law school attracts high-performing competitive people. You very quickly figure out the highly coveted accolades—whether they be certain summer internships, spots on reviews or journals, big law interviews, clerkships, jobs at high regarded law firms, etc. I spent a lot of time competing for things that I had no interest in before law school. Then, after law school I grappled with exactly what I wanted to do with my law degree. I probably could have done some of that soul-searching work in law school and better directed my interests. There were classmates who were competitive about the things they cared about. My biggest mistake was that I did not unplug from the competitive grind to better understand what really drove me.
What class(es) did I wish I had taken while in law school? In or outside the school? What about today?
I wish I had done more clinics and taken more classes with adjunct professors. My law school had an amazing clinical program and great practicing lawyers and judges teaching every semester. Some the best interns and young lawyers I have worked with transfer their real-world clinical experience to being effective advocates in practice. I, wrongly, had the attitude that after graduation I would get my fill of practical lawyering and exposure to practitioners. I chose to take classes that were mostly academic focused. It wasn't until my 3L year that I took more adjunct classes, which helped refine and deepen my perspective for the cases I was studying in my more academic classes.
Most useful classes in law school
Constitutional Law, the foundations from which everything flows, knowing and understanding the history of our most seminal cases has certainly helped and been useful. Trial Advocacy, learning and understanding the foundational concepts of how to advocate and stand up in front of judges and juries not only helps me in the moment when I am doing it, but also in case preparation. Venture Capital, helping a person attain justice is not unlike leading an entrepreneurial dream to a place of success. VC taught me to focus on achieving a successful outcome for my clients through, defined goals, skilled negotiation, and staged strategic thinking.
How did you decide what to do post-law school? With hindsight, how good of a job did you do?
My decision post-law school was simple—I liked the firm I was working for, I liked the lawyers, and they offered me a job. I was happy to land somewhere I enjoyed working. Based on those criteria, I did a good job. But what I learned from that first job is that I needed to also have a connection to the work I was doing. I needed to feel like I was part of a greater purpose. So, I adjusted my criteria and left my law firm, where I was doing mostly business law, to go to the public defender's office. At the public defenders I found a welcoming community of lawyers dedicated to fighting for our indigent clients. In hindsight, my first law job, like all past experiences, has made me who I am today and was part of my process to realizing professional fulfillment.
Biggest mistake you made while at your first job
I perceived that asking for help was a sign of incompetence. I perceived that I needed to be practice ready and able to do the job on day one. I went to law school, passed the bar, and now I needed to be ready. I toiled on projects to get them right and would often deliver close to perfection where it was not needed or misunderstand the scope of the assignment because I was afraid to burden more senior attorneys with my inquiries.
I quickly learned that by following up, asking questions, and consistently communicating, I could complete my assignments in a timelier manner and at the quality level they required.Best advice you received or have given for those coming out of law school
There are three pieces of advice that I regularly revisit:
1. Continuously evaluate what drives you. Professional growth requires self-reflection. Often our reflections as lawyers look more like self-critiques. This piece advice reminds me to evaluate where I feel energized and driven in my practice. It is a kinder, more invigorating reflection and often helps me zero-in on the next steps in my trajectory.
2. When stagnant, get to moving. When I feel stuck, whether is it with a case or just generally with my profession, this piece of advice reminds me to not wait for inspiration, but to get moving and find my inspiration. Set up a coffee with a trusted advisor, get out and do something in nature, attend an interesting CLE or event, etc. Anything that isn't sitting at my computer feeling stuck.
3. Read the rules. Interestingly, lawyers spend a lot of time strategizing and trying to find solutions to certain issues when the answers are often written down in rules, practice standards, or holdings. Spending time on the front-end by simply “reading the rules” has saved me the heartburn of spending hours on a matter before finding some material clarity that I should have discovered much earlier on.
Worst advice you received or have given for those coming out of law school
“Only network up.”
When building relationships in our profession, so much of the emphasis is on connecting with “the boss,” only people with much more time into the profession than you. Building those relationships is important, but the relationships and work you do with your peers is just as important. After law school you will watch your peers and colleagues do great things. Having an authentic relationship you went to school, worked, and/or essentially came up together with someone is extremely underemphasized.
How have you remained happy in your profession? Have there been times when you were not? If so, what did you do to improve your situation?
I have not always remained happy in my profession, but I don't think that is a bad thing. I have come to learn that being happy professionally is as much about knowing what works for you as it is identifying what does not work. There were so many law practice choices that I had given little thought to before law school. Public or private? Large, medium, or small? Neutral or advocate? Litigation, transactional or other? Workplace culture? I did not have a strong reaction to or opinion of most of these until I had some experience. Where I am today is as much about what I like as it is about what I did not like. The key for me is, if you are unhappy, figure out how you can change your situation.
If you could go back in time and tell your younger self something about making the transition from law school to the real world, what would it be?
You don't have to be perfect. Just be the best version of your authentic self. And trust your gut, it's gotten you this far.